NMMNG is for someone who wants to change their way of thinking and improve their life. This tribes aim will be to go through the steps and hold each other accountable
3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
Why would it seem rational for a person to try to eliminate or hide certain things about himself and try to become something different unless there was a significant compelling reason for him to do so?
I don't like this question to begin with as it's loaded: Why does it seem rational to hide things and become different unless there was a rational reason to do so? Am I interpreting the question wrong because there's no reason to hide/change who you are unless there is a reason. Maybe a not so compelling reason would require the individual to be ill informed or feel guilty over something that isn't shameful. They just possess a misconception.
Why do people try to change who they really are?
People change who they are for a handful of reasons but before I dive into that, most people don't change who they are when they see something they don't like, they go on suffering through it. Typically people change who they are once they've had enough. It takes the breaking down internally to foster change. What they're changing has caused issues in life, they're attempting to mitigate further problems stemming from that issue.
You get sick and tired of living life this way; either that encourages more self destruction to cope with living life this way or you start living life differently.
Read More3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
Chapter one left me scratching my head; maybe I am a nice guy after all? While I hold my doubts, the start of the book had me nodding my head along to the traits of the nice guys partner: never saying sorry is a huge mantra in my life. It is what it is.
As the chapter unraveled Glover started digging into traits and behaviors of a nice guy. Alot of what was listed is reminiscent of my first and last real relationship as against better judgment, following her advice because she had more experience with failed relationships, it ended toxic.
Though I stand hard on the fact I'm not a nice guy there are a lot of situations in life I let things go the other way because it's easier than upsetting the wave, though I've got no issue standing firm on core beliefs.
Another issue I seemingly share with nice guys is dating down, looking at people for their potential. Not just lovers but comrades as well.
Always thinking you can just work harder or do it myself tonget shit done.
All and all it has me wondering.
Read More3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
Do you want me to hold off on my review until Saturday at 8 I believe is what you said?
As for the first exercise y'all are my support group though I've got one male guy that'd be more than happy to have me lean on him out here.
3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
@Kloi I am excited to see where this book takes us. I do not know this Jon guy either. He seems poofy to me.
I do not see anything wrong with taking notes when reviewing or giving a speech on a topic (I did to write this).
Most of the nice guy syndromes glover addresses do describe me which is why I was drawn to this book and felt the need to create this tribe.
I am almost glad you identify with doing for others in order to feel loved. It is why I put out more then I am capable of and end up hurting myself and others. I do not see anything wrong with crying especially if it means you had an epiphany.
I gather from your review you are a lot further along on your journey then I am when it comes to self discovery and knowing who you are. This is good on a selfish level for me.
Something Jon brought up in the book and have heard before since joining RP. Is, people will treat you how you allow them to treat you. This was profound to me and is the main focus of this book.
A major issue I had with Jon is when he said it isn't okay or healthy to be selfish. It most certainly is! You can not be an integrated male without putting your needs first. Jon also says Glover does not teach you how to give but asks you to. This is not true and will be evident when we go through the book.
NMMNG is about being selfish and self development 1st and foremost, which is why I dont understand Jon's beef with Glover, when Jon says Glover doesnt discuss the needs of your partner. Which again he does.
When Jon gets into Masculinity is when I start to loose him, he has a take on it I don't agree with but would have a few short months ago. It is necessary for the man to be the leader, there are kings and queens. The king must be on top. There are sharks and salmon. Jon wants to take the teeth away from the sharks and make the relationship 50/50. The salmon will get bored and resent the shark and leave (thank you black phillip).
Lastly I am living proof that western civ is anti Male. I needed to discover RP. I was never taught how to lead, how to put myself first. How to be a Man.
All in all, Jon made a few good points and some really awful ones. He does go on to say that the book has flaws but is a must read which i do agree with.
Read More3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
@Kloi thank you for such an in depth and coherent review! I apologize. I thought you were the one who recommend I watch this video. I tried going back in my history to see who did but can’t find it. As soon as I I have my morning coffee I will type up a reply to your comment as well as my own thoughts on Jon’s review
3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
Why it the book review an hour long?
So far I stand by the fact, I am not a nice guy and this book isn't geared towards men like me. Though the reasoning for nice guys is interesting. I'd agree there is a break down of male relationships within society.
I'm also having a hard time appreciating the reviewer as IDK who he is but he doesn't look hard. Even running it in the background, the fact he needs to read from his laptop is bothersome to me.
Did relate to the not knowing if anyone would like me for me part as my status in my social circles was directly tied to what I could provide and what I got done for the crew though his crying again turned me off. My takeaway from that, we are are own worth critics. You really don't know who you are, surrounded by everyone else.
Now we're getting a little closer to home, I enjoy doing those contracts but I learned early on, I'm laying out rose peddles not for her but for my own imagery. The only way I've not had this weaponized against me, is to give it away freely. I'm not cooking her breakfast in bed because we fucked, I'm doing it because she's still passed out, I need to eat anyways. Yes it has scared girls off because they thought I was falling in love. Woman in general aren't use to a man who can behave romantically while the passion isn't geared for them.
Then he touches on an issue I've had; loving for their potential. Thinking we'd fix ourselves up together. Focusing on her needs. I did this because she told me that's what was expected and I took her advice as she'd had plenty of experience in failed relationships. TRP confirmed a lot of internal beliefs that Dad showed me.
Actually at this point, a lot of what is being discussed is reminiscent of my first two LTPs. It's interesting because I was still seeing other woman on the side, you wouldn't consider this nice guy behaviors.
you are what you settle for in a relationship.
Ouch, slapped me in my face.
I want this to be a short, punchy review
He says 27 minutes into an hour long book review, of a book that should take four hours to finish.
There is nothing wrong with being selfish and self-centered as you can help more from the top than from the bottom. Keeping that helping mindset helps this self centered life style from getting out of hand. That's part of the reason the speaker has a huge grain of salt with me, he doesn't look like a guy I'd take/listen to do in real life situations.
Being alpha male is 100% about competition, he said something about monkeys and their alphas helping the tribe in the wild but fails to mention beta males aren't helping the tribe without direction or exploitations from the alphas. While I don't know what TedTalk he is referring to, I've read Goodall's works. Social hierarchies are based of exactly that, competition. You don't get to the top, or alpha position without competing.
Dude goes onto to describe being violet, aggressive as being toxic though again, you don't get to the top without asserting yourself, without aggressively. All in all I hate when guys do this as the vast majority of the population would benefit more from toxic masculinity than from toning down, killings the ego and behaving passively.
Then he goes on to shit on generally masculine activities; hunting and sports in particular throughout civilizations history has typically be filled by males because it requires more masculine traits to complete, like fuck you are not going find a surplus of masculine males at a crochet party or doing pottery because the barrier for entry is much lower to complete these tasks. Same with the risk, you very well could die in a hunting accident or playing foot ball. It's a hell of lot harder to die while sewing. Risk taking is naturally a masculine characteristic from the wild for the plethora of reason which is why you generally see more masculine males doing risky shit.
Yes culture has changed but we haven't out grown millenniums of evolution. Dude looks like soy boy, he looks like half the HWP guys I run into downtown Portland.
Ohhh like than man is head of the house hold yes I really want to quite listening to him, there is no such thing as a 50/50 relation. Someone always has to take the lead, a good leader knows when to listen to his first mate. Leading doesn't mean absolute rule. I agree with Glover, most woman don't want this postion. Which is true, dude says it's not but can't go on to describe a better alternative.
We are in antimale climate, dude does nothing to disprove Glover's statement, he's as guilty of the charges he's pushing. Lost what little respect I had for the speaker at this point.
I agree with Glover again, a lot of men really do get led around by the dick. I've done it, I've put up with shitty personality because the sex was good.
I disagree, from reading Goodall actually, that monogamy is wired into our DNA. Sex at Dawn was a good book on why this biologically doesn't stand up.
The ending is getting muddled, I really need to look at the book with what the speaker is saying, or rewatch this section to pull out what is being said. Partially because I've been the big fish in a little pond, pulling pussy via status, similar to the speakers accusations at Glover.
Meditation is good, yes I agree.
He contradicts himself by saying tribal rights of passages aren't needed but their warrior training combines those with modern concepts to create blah blah blah to navigate modern society. What I hear is society lacks rights of passage for you boys moving into manhood, we made some modern ones up for you.
Yes to not masturbating to porn and for the physical sensation vs getting off to fanticy.
He wraps the video up by stating it's worthless to bitch about society being anti male, which seems redundant considering he told us earlier it's hard to make the claim society is anti male.......which is it buddy?
Then he's back to what is and isn't masculine: Shakespeare, Hemenway, Stephen King, Da Vinci, Picasso, Spielberg....the list goes on and the point is, I've never thought of the arts as anti masculine, I don't know anyone who really has outside of the truly ignorant. Mastery of any talent is in my opinion, a masculine trait.
All and all I feel this video was fifty minutes too long while still having a hard time viewing the speaker as a masculine spokesperson while Glover at the very least, is a scientist.
Read More3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
thank you @Kloi for suggesting this video
www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3rvqd09gro&t=278s
I believe our first weekly assignment before we even open the book should be to watch this video and discuss Jons reaction to it
3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
I just bought a hard copy of NMMNG, it should be arriving Monday. As of now I just have the audible but I think if we are to go through the steps together It would be best to have the actual book in front of us
3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
@Kloi come on now, you mean to tell me you didn't love school? Okay I like that idea. I am on EST, I am free weeknights after 7:30 and depending on the weekend I should be free Sunday evenings as well. What works for everyone else?
3y ago No more Mr. nice guy
Weekly assignments with a general turn in/discussion day. Just like school except I want to be here.