@kawzero

Forum Post Title: Should I Next Her, Pivot to the Roommate, or Just Grind? Cold Analysis Needed.

TL;DR: Met (Girl A) while helping a friend move. She showed high interest (playful, compliant, invested). Got her number, waited 5 days, then tried to set up a date. She flaked/hesitated several times, answered once with uncertainty, then missed my confirmation call. I’ve decided to next her. Her Roommate (Girl B) showed IOIs; considering whether to pivot or focus on grind. Need blunt feedback.

BACKGROUND: I’m a guy in my mid-twenties who has been deeply studying Red Pill philosophy and Game (Have read, Swinggcat, Mystery, Rollo Tomassi, Corey Wayne etc) after realizing my own past beta tendencies. I'm actively working on building a high-value frame. Here’s my current situation:

FINANCES: I just finished university. I'm not rich yet, but I'm financially independent through freelance tech gigs, able to cover my needs and my own rented apartment. I'm working on executing my own startup idea.

PHYSIQUE: I've been lifting consistently for 1 year and 5 months and have built significant muscle.

LOOKS: To be objective, I'm a good-looking guy, around an 8/8.5 on the scale. I've received high levels of admiration and IOIs from girls since I was young. (I even had an extreme incident as a child where an older girl aggressively came onto me, which I mention only to underscore the level of attention I've gotten. When I was 7 (2007), a girl tried to seduce me but I ran away and nothing happened).

MY CORE ISSUE: Despite the IOIs, I have never spun plates or had sex. I'm still a virgin. I typically either screw things up by becoming needy/beta, chatting on Whatsapp too much, etc. after the initial approach, OR sometimes I just lose interest and ignore the girl early on, failing to capitalize on the opportunities. My mission is to break this cycle by fully internalizing Redpill and game doctrine, achieving an alpha frame—outcome independence, leading, and eliminating neediness.

THE SITUATION: It was Monday, I was helping a friend move his last items out of his old apartment, which five new female roommates had just moved into.

THE INITIAL INTERACTION (The Meet): While moving a couch, one of the girls offered to help. I delayed and said, "If you want." Before she could move, her roommate, let's call her (Girl A), stepped up, grabbed the couch, and said, "Let's go." We carried it out together.

I then said, "Sorry, there's one more thing, the TV stand." She said, "No problem," and we moved that too. She even stayed by the truck with me, helping arrange the items with the driver—showing high investment.

After we left, we had to return for one last item. I called (Girl A) over, saying I had a question. She joked, "Hope I'm not in trouble?" I played along, "Well, maybe, we'll find out."

As we walked out, I teased her:

Me: "Are you above trouble?"

Her: "Yes."

Me: "What makes you think you're above trouble?"

She just smiled, unable to answer. We were outside now. I introduced myself, made small talk, and then went for the close.

Me: "I might not see you again. Let me have your number, if that's fine with you."

Her: "Okay, but I don't know it by heart. Give me your number, I'll flash you, and you can save it."

Me (teasing): "You said you're above trouble but don't know your number?" I gave her my phone; she called it right there. I saved it, and we said goodnight.

Her compliance, investment, and playfulness felt like high interest (8/10+).

THE FOLLOW-UP & THE PROBLEM (Full TIMELINE WITH ALL CALLS):

SATURDAY (5 days later, 10:00 AM): I called to set up a same-day meet for 7:00 PM. She didn't pick, but called back ~5 minutes later.

Me: "What's up, what's going on?"

Her: "Fine."

Me: "Let's meet today, 7pm."

Her: "Uhm... Let me see how it will be, cuz I'm on my way to school right now."

Me: "Okay."

I said nothing else and the call ended. I expected if she was interested, she'd text me later if she could make it. She never did that evening.

TUESDAY (3 days after the Saturday flake): I called again to set up a meet for Wednesday. She didn't pick and did not call back.

WEDNESDAY: I called one last time that around 7pm. She picked the call in seconds and greeted me "good evening." The call went like this:

Me: "What's up, what's going on?"

Her: "Fine."

Me: "Let's meet tomorrow (Thursday, 7pm."

Her: "Okay, I'll see how it goes.")

Me: "Cool. I'll call you."

Then I ended the call. (I later regretted saying "I'll call you" — should have kept it tighter like "See you 7pm.")

THURSDAY (day of the planned meet; confirmation attempt): It started raining lightly that evening. Around 6:00 PM (I wanted to confirm because of the weather), I called to confirm the 7pm meet. She did not pick. This was the second time she had not called back after missing my call. At this point I decided to next her completely. I even want to delete her contact.

Additional Context — The Roommate (Girl B): During the initial move, I also interacted with her roommate, Girl B. In front of everyone (including Girl A), this happened:

Me: "I'm [My Name]. And you are?"

Girl B: "I'm [Girl B]."

Me: "All the girls I knw named [Girl B's Name] are always troublesome and stubborn."

Her (playfully defensive): "Me, I'm not a troublesome girl and I'm not stubborn!"

It was a clear, positive IOI. Recently when I saw Girl B on the street, she acted shy—avoiding eye contact, looking down, left, right, until we passed each other.

WHERE I’M AT MENTALLY NOW: At this point, with all the terrible failed experiences I've had over the years and my current stage (25 yrs, trying to establish my dream startup)... I want to totally drop girls and focus on my grind.

When I’m rich, have my dream car, and can travel the world — that’s when I’ll spin plates. At that point, I’ll be ruthless in my approaches. I won’t waste time on flakes or weak interest.

MY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS FOR THE FORUM:

1. Initial Analysis: Based on the first interaction, was my read of her high interest level correct?

2. The Critical Mistake: Where did I go wrong? Was it calling too late (5 days)? The same-day date request? Or my passive “Okay” response?

3. Damage Control: Is my decision to next her and not contact her again the correct alpha move? Is there any recovering this?

4. The Roommate Switch: Should I consider Girl B, or is that a messy/desperate play that will blow up with both of them? If it’s viable, how should I approach it?

5. Direct Approach: Given my physique and looks, should I be more direct in future approaches? Rollo mentions directness can be effective if you are physically appealing, but I want the forum’s take on this for my specific situation.

6. Grind: Should I just forget girls totally for now? Honestly I'm losing interest. Totally.

CLOSING: Guys, I need your solid advice please — especially from men who have been at my stage and conquered. I’m okay with criticism, so be blunt.

ATTEMPT TO ANSWER YOUR OWN QUESTION:

• I feel I overated her interest levels(Girl A). Maybe she was just being a nice girl

• Following her roommate (Girl B) won't be wrong. I think it will create triangles among the girls.

Consider investing into a reliable ready reference you can pick up and study to better prepare yourself for engaging the opposite sex. I'd suggest that you get yourself a copy of Doc Love's "The System: The Dating Dictionary". Doc Love, who until his passing was also known as Tom Hodges, wrote a weekly advice column that's archive is mirrored on several mens focused sites and a podcast. His media is a bit pricey, but it's a solid foundation a guy can branch out from in RP aware circles. I'd suggest you review his advice column to decide if his view on dating and relationships is aligned with what you aspire for yourself. To save yourself a search, give this scribed link a gander to find out if his #book is something you'd like to add to your library. It should also be available on libgen.

@Typo-MAGAshiv Very solid approach bro.

@Jocbro I'll suggest these steps, similar to what @Typo-MAGAshiv said...

NOTE: I've done this and found it to be de easiest/most effective cure for me.

1.) START THE OLD SCHOOL WAY:

Approach 21 chicks and open with anything u want (cocky, rude, funny etc). Just be outcome independent doing this. Try to be rejected.

The main aim here is to configure ur brain and kill ur nerves. Do the approaches as much as possible to silence ur nerves. Track de increase in ur confidence level.

2.) ONCE UR ANXIETY IS ALMOST COMPLETELY GONE...

You can now tailor ur approaches to girls that catch ur eyes. This time, ensure to...

FIRST: Observe her well, and, gauge her interest level via IOIs ( strong eye contact, shyness, blush, a mirror of ur gesture, preening etc). Then...

2ND STEP: Strike !!!! (Approach and open her like a G )

NOTE: Be outcome independent and don't try to be a nice guy.

GOOD luck

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