@Typo-MAGAshiv When you talk about these things, I can see you have a deep background in the manosphere. Very impressive.

I think its the binary nature of Alpha and Beta that make it such an attractive idea for people -just stop being so beta and switch on being alpha and all your woes are fixed.

I find myself falling into Alpha and Beta sometimes when talking about a guy who is doing his bit blue pill style to support and cherish a woman who is taking him for granted, I tend to think of and refer to him as "her beta"

I have sometimes thought it useful to look at Alpha and Beta through the light of female perception not male reality. I like to look at it like this.

There are two main routes to pussy in a normal mentally healthy woman, the Alpha and Beta routes. It is important to understand that these routes exist inside a woman's head not in the real world. The standard route is the Beta route. Pussy is earned. A male has to meet a threshold of sufficient quality to be accepted but then he also has to court and protect a woman, give resources to her and mate guard her, then when she feels in the mood, she will be open to him sexually. In short Briffault's law applies.

There is also a system for exceptions -the Alpha route. Here a male appears to be of sufficient quality -whether from looks, status or wealth that he simply can't be passed up on. For this man rules will be broken and he can have pussy on credit. The on credit bit is important because this route never endures long in an unbroken relationship. If a relationship starts by this route and the woman actually gets to eventually claim the man as "her's" she will eventually revert to only offering the man the standard Beta route.

There are plenty of good examples of this to be seen in the marriages of handsome, wealthy, famous men who get snagged by a hot groupie and end up being her beta. In most cases the man knows his worth and does not get snagged. He moves on and the woman pines for him and a man of his perceived value. In some cases the woman can become bitter and feel she has cheated herself and want to make it the man's fault for "using her". This is very common in the case of young women who fell for a man in a perceived position of authority -like a college lecturer or junior staff who fell for their boss.

My old school is currently having an amusingly belated paedo hunt. I gather it is to do with a girl who fell for a teacher back in the early 90's just after I had left. Back in those days a love affair between a 17 year old student and an English teacher was an open secret. The girl's own father found it simply a cause for eye rolling and no one was that bothered (it was a silly liberal school). My old pal's little sister used to keep a look out while the teacher banged the girl the stationary cupboard. The girl loved it. Now post wall, she suddenly decided that she was used and it was time to shout "Me too! me too" Don't forget me!" But the fact was that she couldn't help herself at the time. She though he was such value, she couldn't help but hunt him down.

This is why we need laws about teachers and students. Its not because its unnatural and perverted for older men to pursue young women, its because its only too natural for young women to fall for men they perceive as high value and tempt them to their destruction. There is this Alpha route that circumvents women's usual defences and PUAs practice the tells of high value in the hope of triggering this route.

There are also unhealthy women, broken by years of slutting who simply use this route as a way to give themselves temporary validation and pleasure and they are easy meat for PUAs but they too tend to feel they have cheated themselves in the end. You can't always put out on credit and not feel cheated in the end.

@First-light

either kicking against it

Back on Roosh's PUA forum around 2000-2002, I fought tooth and nail against the use of "alpha" and "beta" like that.

It was like trying to stop a tsunami with my hands.

I never got the idea of the Sigma, surely there are just lots of different sorts of Alpha

That's been pretty much the response of anyone with a brain. The only people latching onto "sigma" are asocial dorks who try to reframe their status as outcasts into being "too cool for school".

And in fairness to Vox Day, he did predict that in his writeup of this crap back when he first came up with it.

depending on... situation...

To what extent are these rankings situational as opposed to general? We can all think of a leader at a club who is really quite low ranking in life but is a revered expert in his field, often rather irritatingly using his temporary status to grab all the female attention he can.

Roissy/Heartiste called that "the Situational Alpha".

I recall one particular example was this nerdy-ass teacher who ended up fucking one of his (underage, if memory serves) students. Dude was a total Melvin everywhere else in his life, but in his classroom, he was viewed as a king (at least by the student he fucked).

The only use I've seen for this Greek letter silliness is what was originally proposed by Athol Kay and since then adopted by MRP: alpha and beta as behaviors and traits that all men possess to varying degrees, and can learn to tailor them to certain goals.

@Typo-MAGAshiv I agree. I find myself either kicking against it or only using it in humour, particularly in response to good shit posts.

I think it may have had some mileage once in describing men in situations where there are unspoken rankings but you can't take it too far or it becomes one of those pseudo sciences like phrenology in the past or sociology today.

I never got the idea of the Sigma, surely there are just lots of different sorts of Alpha behaviour, often depending on whether this is big dog's home patch in which he is invested or if a high status male is just doing his shit and does not seek to rule in a situation as opposed to do what he likes?

How far down the Greek alphabet do you sub divide men. Do we stop at epsilon?

To what extent are these rankings situational as opposed to general? We can all think of a leader at a club who is really quite low ranking in life but is a revered expert in his field, often rather irritatingly using his temporary status to grab all the female attention he can.

Surely an omicron just by the name is worse than an omega? I would rather be a big o than a little one wouldn't you?