Welp, it had to happen eventually. Somebody will want to talk politics so here it is. This is specifically for US Politics
Americans used to do all those jobs that illegals do now, but wages were better then too.
Let me know when stoop labor on farms, and grunt work in industries like construction and meat packing, actually starts paying "wages Americans are willing to work for" much less actually starts HIRING Americans lining up for these jobs.
Meanwhile, promises that "ICE is only going after the worst of the worst criminals" are not playing out in reality. The big Human Trafficking task force was recently broken up, to provide more agents to chase brown people on farms, swap meets, and Home Depot parking lots, and hold them in private equity money milking prisons without due process. Polls are increasingly returning numbers of "That's not what we voted for!" on these actual practices.
Read MoreIt didn't pay shit, and you bust your ass picking up heavy, smelly garbage all day. Fast forward a few decades, and since it's a necessary function, the pay has increased substantially to the point that more people are willing to be garbage collectors than there are spots for them.
Absolutely false premise you chose as your example here. TECHNOLOGY and capital investment in equipment changed the job. Used to be each garbage truck was a crew of 2 workers, the driver, and the guy who lifted the cans into the back of the truck and cycled the compactor.
Now, municipal garbage cans are standardized for automated picking and lifting. The truck only has the driver on board; he literally never gets out of the truck much less touches garbage or garbage cans even one time per shift. These jobs also nearly always include Union representation bargaining hard for pay and working conditions; those weren't just given to the workers from the kindness of the owner class's hearts.
The increases in profits wrought by mechanizing the job, mostly get funneled upward into elite class pockets, often because private equity bought up and monetized garbage collection systems along with damn near everything else nationwide.
It's a blindness, to attribute working class poverty and shrinking middle class, to the dirt poor and powerless immigrant class. Scapegoating them is part of the ruling class program, to deflect attention and rightful blame away from themselves.
Read More@Typo-MAGAshiv Labor's share of gross national income has declined over the decades and is quite low now. It's not solely due to illegal immigration but that plays a substantial role. Slavery, the women's movement, and illegal immigration were all aimed at the same objective: keeping downward pressure on wages. Americans used to do all those jobs that illegals do now, but wages were better then too. When I was growing up, it was common for boys to work construction jobs in the summer and make good money. You don't see as much of that now.
Increased supply of labor = lower wages.
What I love too is how a lot of the people advocating on behalf of the illegal aliens (and why are they championing criminals?) will say shit like "but they're doing the jobs Americans won't do!"
If Americans aren't filling the jobs, then the pay is too low.
Great example: when I was a kid, no one wanted to be a garbage collector. It didn't pay shit, and you bust your ass picking up heavy, smelly garbage all day.
Fast forward a few decades, and since it's a necessary function, the pay has increased substantially to the point that more people are willing to be garbage collectors than there are spots for them.
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@Typo-MAGAshiv Well said. I'm not sure why anyone would think the housing or labor markets are immune from basic supply and demand principles such that massively increasing demand and supply, respectively, wouldn't affect prices. Increased population = increased demand for housing = higher housing prices. Increased supply of labor = lower wages. Pretty basic.
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"They're the ones fighting to replace regular Americans with cheap illegal aliens, who in turn drive up prices on everything (especially housing)."
The boomers in the hood who are hoarding houses to rent out and have the time in the middle of a business day to attend town hall meetings are the ones who are driving up the housing prices. This has little to nothing to do with immigrants.
Holy fuck, that's an abysmal understanding of how things work. Let's break this down...
The boomers
FFS, I'm so sick of people blaming "the boomers" for everything. That generation is not a monolith and is just at varied as any other group of any sort. Just being born between 1946 and 1960 doesn't mean shit. Example: my own mom is a baby boomer, and she's poor (mostly due to her own bad decisions, such as divorcing my dad way back in the day). She sure as shit isn't "deciding what housing prices are" because if she were, she'd lower her own.
in the hood who are hoarding houses to rent out and have the time in the middle of a business day to attend town hall meetings are the ones who are driving up the housing prices.
hoarding houses to rent out
Most landlords don't "hoard" houses. Most only have one or two rental properties, and they try to avoid owning anything in "the hood". And most landlords still work regular jobs, the passive income from rent not being enough to quit. Mind you, I'm talking about independent landlords who are individual people, and not property owing companies that own and rent out apartments, etc. Source: I've known several over the years, and I might become one myself in the next 2-3 years if things go well.
driving up the housing prices. This has little to nothing to do with immigrants. [emphasis added]
Basic fucking supply and demand, guy. You increase a population, they need places to live, demand for housing goes up, and the price of housing goes up.
It doesn't get any more basic than that.
Billionaires want you to blame imigrants because they don't want you to blame them
Bullshit.
The "billionaires" are the ones trying to open the floodgates for illegal aliens as well as legal immigrants to replace us, the American working class. They want to drive wages down and housing prices up. They oppose Trump and his deportations at every turn. Examples: Jeff Bezos, Mark Cuban, Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates, Jack Dorsey, George Soros, etc.
;There are only a few bad aspects of immigration I can see--and these are far outnumbered by the advantages
You have some massive blind spots, then.
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lowered wages
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increased housing costs
- increased crime
Those are the biggest reasons to want them gone, and frankly, if someone has so little regard for our laws that they sneak in instead of entering properly, then fuck them. I don't want them here at all.
The administration have done nothing to fix these issues so far anyway. Not even a little bit.
LMAO, OK, you really are blind. It's been deportations galore since Trump came back into office, and I'm loving it.
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I just watched the House Speaker, sometimes called Maga Mike, try to pretend that a voice vote to release the Epstein files that was clearly majority Aye, was no, then instantly pivot away from the subject. Laughter actually rippled through the chamber because his attempt to deflect looked so blatant and weak. A roll call vote then followed with a clear majority Aye.
A wide split between the parties looks obvious in man on the street discussions as well. Walk up to any leftie or progressive and say "Bill Clinton is in the Epstein files too!" Without hesitation, the response comes, Don't care! Release the files and if they show crimes charge the mofo. Ask pretty much any right partisan, and out comes a Mashup of DARVO heavy deflection and excuses.
@bambinosupremo Old-school social democrat (without the identity politics, jealousy politics, and wokeness).
I believe in the nation state, national identity, and commercial competition between nation states (which will get me branded as "far-right" today). The quality of a government should (amongst other things) be measured on how competitive it helps the nation and its commerce be.
I believe in a tax funded social security net. That means tax funded education, tax funded health care, tax funded unemployment benefits, tax funded sick leave, tax funded maternity and paternity leave, tax funded child care etc. etc. Tax funded education is extremely important for social mobility (a.k.a. "The American Dream"). And affordable health care is just a basic human need (it's wild to me that some would rather have their employer decide whether they get healthcare or not).
I believe in a free market where pricing is set by the demands of the market. But I also believe in some government regulation. I really only need to mention "fishing quotas" to prove that government regulation is a thing that needs to exist.
I'm "small government" in the sense that I would always want the government to be as small as possible. But my understanding of "possible" is probably not the same as that of a libertarian. I'm not necessarily in favor of a "department of education" and such things, if it means overreaching. Middle management and public sector bullshit jobs can always be shaven away in the name of government efficiency and spending.
I'm fascinated by small government ideas like libertarianism, and even anarcho-capitalism. But I view them as ideals to keep government spending in check - not actual, working policy when fully implemented. I regard education and health care as on par with the military when it comes to the question of what's the government's job.
I believe in strong workers' unions, and negotiation between worker's unions and employers' unions.
I'm not "anti government". And I don't believe that "government" and "personal freedom" are two opposing forces. I believe the (impersonal) government can facilitate personal freedom better than your employer, your parents, or your spouse can.
I don't suffer from Trump Derangement Syndrome (and yes, I believe it to be a thing). In that regard, I'm probably regarded as a far-right, Qanon, conspiracy nut.
I don't trust the media - whatsoever. Not the majority "leftist" media, and not the minority "alternative" media either. Again, this is probably mostly seen as far-right, Qanon, conspiracy, nazi territory.
Til;dr: All in all, social democrat. I think the Scandinavian countries get a lot of things right with regards to the role of government.
Read More@bambinosupremo I lean center. I am for freedom as long as someone's freedom doesn't violate others' freedoms.
I'm not okay with lgbt+ but I can live with it as long as they keep it reasonably private--or at least don't stick it in my face.
I despise tyrants and one-man governments regardless of how they're disguised. Yes, that includes Trump. In other circumstances, I could very well vote red.
Feel the same way about monopolies and lobbyists.