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I think Nietzsche was right when he said we need to Transvaluate all values, in every place. What is considered EVIL in society is actually GOOD, and vice versa. EVERYWHERE. What the left attacks most is what is most true.
Forgot to address this in my last reply.
I agree, funnily enough. In a post I made recently I proposed something along these lines through a method of trial to the individual which would bring self actualisation. The opposite is clearly the case in the modern world, the less you try to do the more comfortable you can be, but our lizard brains are affronted and we become miserable and depressed because we do nothing and achieve nothing.
Self actualisation on a large scale leads to an actualised culture that is capable of great feats of wonder, many testaments to this fact spread across the ancient world. Self actualisation doesn't come without the sacrifice of our comforts and our present though, imagine telling kids these days what they would have to sacrifice to be truly happy? Ha! No, it's more important for degeneracy to prosper so that they can emulate meaning for the least amount of cost to themselves.Read More
I'll concede to the BLM point, as your description of their religious fervour is actually quite accurate. Perhaps it is a latent appeal to conservative values? A thin mockery of a prevailing culture that they hope to emulate through their actions? This itself is worth exploring in more detail.
Could Christianity have any other conclusion than what we are seeing now?
Interesting question, with no easy answer. Whereas you see the moral values of Christianity as a form of stasis for the adherents, I see it as a map for the lost.
If I were to use Plato's example of the shadow on the wall of the cave as an example (the shadow in this case being Jesus' teachings) the exoteric understanding of the shadow has one dimension, one state of being. Quite rightly, this shadow doesn't exist without the source of light, which I would provide as the 'meaning' behind the teaching.
The shadow then, is the literal form of the teaching, observed and understood only as it appears on the wall. If one could only turn their head to see the light, they would see beyond the shadow and then be able to explore the esoteric. It's all well and good understanding the shadow, but all it ever is is an opinion. The shadow is good for the exoteric because the corruption of the church can interpret the shadow to its own benefit. Money, power, structure, culture. Now that I've done this analogy sufficiently to death, whether I can rightly suggest that the doctrine of the church is separated from the message of Christ and God is another debate entirely, but an assertion I would make nonetheless in being pivotal in answering your question.
I see the inherent value in Christian morality because I don't look at them from the perspective of the shadow, I see what casts the shadow and move to understand that instead. If this were at all achievable on a grand scale, then I would answer yes, there would be other conclusions, but the water is so muddied that it would take sending anyone who is over ten years old into exile and starting over from a new generation.Read More
christianity may have worked in the ancient times for the lower class to build traditional values because they had nothing else. instead of burning cities down they can spend their time in churches. christianity does not work in the modern world, I had to learn that the hard way. nobody cares about your values or morals in the modern world and will most likely hinder your from getting anywhere. back then maybe you could've been a christian knight or some shit but most likely you were raised to be a beta, be nice to everyone, not take advantage of women. it takes a whole lot of unbrainwashing to realize all you've been taught was bs. plus half the people that go to church don't even follow the teachings
@Osiris You can find tons of wisdom in tons of different religious traditions. That doesn't make it special. I'm not saying you can't learn something from the Bible, but to call yourself a Christian and ascribe to Christian morality is a solid indicator of Blue Pill conditioning. For example, I have yet to see a Christian marriage where the man is a "leader". It is 9/10 times the woman with the ballsack. You'd be pressed to find a single masculine man giving up pussy for the 'kingdom'.
The teachings of Christianity were taken literally during the beginning of the Church, and you had a Commune of Metaphysical Communists in Acts. It only changed through the attempts of Missionaries to convert the Germanic tribes in the 400s-600s, where they had to shift tactics and merge the teachings with the culture. The culture you are defending is a mixture of Germanic, Roman, and Christian teachings (See: The Germanization of Early Medieval Christianity by James C. Russell). Even then, from the beginning the ideal is seen as a world denier in pursuit of Christ. See Confessions by St. Augustine, Meditations on the Life of Christ by Thomas A Kempis, Summa Theologica, St. Paul etc. It is the highest ideal of Christianity, when in every tradition prior it was a warrior, and spirituality was considered highest in the warrior. See: Roman Honor, the Fire in the Bones
As for the kids who go to Church vs those who don't, the same underlying moral framework and religious fervor remain. Sure, they disagree on things like Abortion, fornication, LGBTQ, etc. But they are more alike then say, ancient Babylonians. Both world views stem from Christian morality. What you see with BLM is the moral teaching of "love your neighbor as yourself" "love one another as I have loved you" ---> Equality and brotherhood among all men ---> EQUALITY INSANITY.
BLM has some similarities to Christianity. Think about it: you have their Jesus in Ferguson. He died "unjustly". You have religious fervor in those that now see him as a saint. You have moral posturing, you have guilt, you have atonement, you have the same moral outlook that condemns violence, separation, hierarchy, power, etc. I'm not systematizing here, I just see similarities. Finally, I can't even agree on the last point: there is no nihilism in these movements, or in this younger generation. Just because you are atheist doesn't mean you are a nihilist. That is a conflation. The masses believe in right and wrong, you see this in BAM by BAP, GLOGANG, LGBTQ+ , MARXISM, etc. There is no middle ground anymore. Maybe Stephan M (Though he is a dork, and wrong.), but even HE was pushed out of the picture. Conservative Jews are now considered fringe lmao. Clown world.
I do have one question: Could Christianity have any other conclusion than what we are seeing now? I don't think so, given the beliefs and teaching propagate, it would lead to a secular morality which will lead to this insanity all over again. I think Nietzsche was right when he said we need to Transvaluate all values, in every place. What is considered EVIL in society is actually GOOD, and vice versa. EVERYWHERE. What the left attacks most is what is most true.Read More
@Osiris the rejection of christianity is not the fault of christianity but the failure of an entire generation to instill values into their children. I was raised christian, the religion never stuck with me, but the ethics and ideals somewhat did. also met many rich people you would never guess are christians. some multi millionaires.
@Osiris the meek shall inherit in a way means staying humble and waiting to be awarded. a lot of self destruction can come from the thought of being above what you really are. Second part I say about being awarded is staying hardworking and waiting to be awarded by somebody in order to move up. In other words in staying meek somebody may one day notice you and bring up upwards along with them. I get what you're saying none of those things might ever happen if you wait your entire life, but christianity rejects the material world in respect for the spiritual
Everything about the way you interpret Jesus' teachings is taken in the literal sense. I won't go through them all because at the end of the day, we're just going to disagree, but I will put it out there for spectators to see.
Turning the other cheek is to avoid a man becoming consumed with envy and rage when he perceives a slight towards him. I would have my time better spent invested in my own future efforts. [Again, I will point out the deficiency in these teachings from the church as most biblical texts are taught in a literal sense.]
Being poor in spirit means to remain of the attitude of when you were poor, even if you are now wealthy. It means to apply your wisdom as if you still had more to learn.
The meek inheriting the earth is an interesting one in that, even in a literal way, they are due to inherit a sullen wasteland as their voices were silent and their bodies were unspent. Inherit away, who wants the leftovers?
As for Christianity not having and traditional values or spirituality... what can I even say to that? That's just wrong. The traditions that were attached to Christianity through the centuries have slowly eroded (Monarchism for one), granted, but your whole shtick is throwing the baby out with the bath water because you interpreted the moral teachings in such a binary manner.
Getting back to your original post though, another point I'd like to make is that Christianity isn't even that popular amongst younger generations. They may reply to a census as 'Christian' because they were christened or whatever, but so far as reading the bible or attending church? Not likely. So the influence of Christs moral teachings I would say is rather minimal on BLM or other movements. Hell, I can guarantee you that 90% or more of ANTIFA would identify as atheist.
Perhaps we could agree that a rejection of these values took place in younger generations, leading to a gap filled by nihilism. Though I'm sure our agreement would only end there when I propose, once again, this is a failing of the church to translate nuance and responsibility in Christian teachings.Read More
@Crownofstars I'm mostly a freethinking Buddhist and highly interested in science. Some parts of the Buddha's message ared similar to those of Christ. However, the strongest parts, such as not having sex, only apply to monks. For lay Buddhists, the important precepts are:
Do not kill
Do not steal
Do not lie
Do not become too intoxicated so it clouds the mind
Do not have irresponsible sex
These are on the whole, not in consistent with the Red Pill message.
The Buddha says the ultimate aim is enlightenment, which needs total detachment from the world, and the elimination of desires and dislikes. However, this is the goal, and he recognised that most people are a long way from that. So his message is applied in stages. Start with the precepts above, and after many lifetimes you may attain the goal. In the here and now, avoid doing harm and do good where you can.
Karma is the other main teaching. It simply means "cause & effect". If you do bad things, they will come back to you, now or later. If you do good things, they will also come back to you.
Monks must always turn the other cheek because they are on an advanced stage of the path. But lay Buddhists don't have to. They must not be aggressive, but they can defend themselves and others. Violence is never encouraged, but in some circumstances it may be acceptable.
The Buddha himself was born into the warrior class, and he trained as a fighter for the first 27 years of his life. He never had to use those skills, but he always respected soldiers. He just preferred it if the didn't have to fight.Read More